By
Parisa Sadrzadeh
December 9, 2009
Hundreds of people crowd into a big warehouse-looking room with dark painted walls and rows of seats from front to back. At the front is a stage, showered with lights of different colors. The backdrop features a 10-foot cross, and when the lights hit it just right, there’s a silhouette of a crucified Jesus draped in ripped clothing hanging from it.
Photo by Patrick Riley.
Mars Hill Church Pastor Matt Jensen gives his very first Sunday sermon in the U–District. This is in place of the satellite video broadcasts normally sent from the main church in Ballard, given by preaching pastor Mark Driscoll.
Photo by Patrick Riley.
Mars Hill Church starts their services in Kane Hall with worship songs. Following the worship, three weeks out of the month, there is a broadcast from the main church in Ballard.
But most difficult to miss is the casually dressed, passionate man preaching to the left of the stage, Bible in hand and sermon notes projected onto a screen to his left.
This scene takes place weekly in Ballard. Meanwhile, on the UW campus, the same scene is broadcast in a much smaller room, Kane 130, to a much smaller audience — usually about 350 students, faculty and neighbors of the U-District.
However, the man speaking, Pastor Mark Driscoll, presents a message that remains strong, even if heard off of a projection. This increasingly popular setting for college students is held under one name: Mars Hill Church.
“I don’t think it’s something that we’re doing right, in terms of service order or technology or a good band [that attracts so many people],” said Pastor Matt Jensen, one of the Mars Hill pastors who works in the U-District, in a phone interview. “It’s honestly about the good news of Jesus dying for people’s sins, and it’s really freeing for college students.”
Jensen, who just turned 26, says he understands and shares many of the struggles of college students and believes that Jesus has brought Mars Hill to the UW for the purpose of freeing students from those struggles. The U-District location opened three months ago in response to a strong demand by the increasing Mars Hill student population.
The church, growing in numbers only a “megachurch” can support, was started in 1996 in Driscoll’s living room and originally was put in place in Ballard, the church’s main branch. With eight campuses now around Washington state, and plans to build 90 more throughout the country by 2019, the uniqueness and power of this church’s message has given it national and international attention.
“What makes this church unique is that there is an emphasis on the preached word,” said Nick Bogardus, media relations director of Mars Hill. “A lot of churches will talk about ideas or just kind of vague, general spiritual pithy thoughts, like Oprah might give out — you know, feel-good kind of stuff. This actually teaches you the Bible and what God said about himself.”
Three weeks out of every month, each branch of the church uses video broadcasts of Driscoll’s Ballard sermons as a part of their Sunday services. Each branch also hosts its own pastors who preach once a month, but Driscoll is the main preaching pastor.
Claiming that Mars Hill teaches the gospel rather than religion, which the church believes can be a huge block to growth in a relationship with Jesus, Bogardus said they have a few main points they stress: “There’s an emphasis on teaching, an emphasis on that you can actually know truth and an emphasis on training men, like men stepping up and being leaders in their families and marriages.”
The last emphasis is one of the main issues that has fostered some negative feelings in Seattle of Mars Hill being a misogynistic church; as Bogardus puts it: “We are to the right of liberals and to the left of fundamentalists, so you take heat from both sides.” However, from an insider student perspective, what some perceive as an “anti-woman” stereotype is somewhat flipped.
“The week we talked about men in marriage, it was probably the most intense I have ever heard Pastor Mark and probably the most intense I will ever hear him,” said Samantha Meyer, a member of Mars Hill and a UW sophomore. “Basically, he gets on the guys about abusing God’s daughters. Through that sermon and him getting so angry at the guys, I saw how much the men of Mars Hill value women. I never feel like a guy is going to mistreat me when I am with my community.”
Jake Arnes, another member and UW sophomore, directly feels the pressure of the immense responsibility preached to men.
“That’s Mark. His whole thing is we’re all boys and we’re slackers and we suck; that’s intimidating,” Arnes said. “And he pretty much straight up will say that men should go to work and women should stay home, and that just strikes me as wrong.”
Arnes ran into an issue with the church when he started dating one of his longtime friends. One of his Mars Hill mentors believed he wasn’t enough of a man to take on a wife yet, so he shouldn’t be dating at all. Arnes believed otherwise and has been struggling with this type of issue in regards to the church ever since.
“Yeah, I’m not ready to take a wife, but you can’t couple dating with marriage that closely,” he said. “I don’t appreciate [Driscoll’s] tactics sometimes. He just makes fun of us guys in some kind of unfair ways. … Sometimes he’s right, but there are times when there are exceptions, and he dismisses those exceptions.”
Driscoll’s strict teaching approach is what draws many people into the church. He has what he calls open-handed issues, which are debatable and up to people’s opinions, and close-handed issues, which are not up for debate and are what all Christians should believe to be a Christian. When something is close-handed, no matter how controversial the issue is, Driscoll will stand his ground with force.
“I love that he’s straightforward; yeah, there are a lot of people who have different opinions on abortion and on this and that, but he’s straightforward about it,” Meyer said. “He comes off kind of arrogant sometimes, like he jokes saying, ‘Some people think this, but they’re wrong.’ But everything he says is based on Jesus. It’s not his own opinion; it’s biblically sound.”
As powerful and clear as his sermons can be for some congregants, it has been known that some Christians outside of the church worry that Driscoll’s pride and assuredness in his teachings has put him at an idol-like status with his followers, which Driscoll himself spoke strongly against in a recent Nightline interview.
“For many of the congregants that I am in contact with, Driscoll has a he-can-do-no-wrong kind of status and the things he said must be defended at all costs … even (and maybe especially) when he breaks convention or tradition,” said Derek Johnson*, a UW graduate student who is a Christian and a member of a smaller church in Shoreline, in an e-mail.
Even Arnes, who has decided to stay at Mars Hill despite his issues with some of its doctrine because, he says, he can separate his church from his relationship with God, believes that some people at Mars Hill do worship Driscoll more than they should.
“I think right now, if Mark disappeared, it’s not going to look good there,” he said. “It’s sad and not super easy to control.”
Johnson also had an issue with the marketing of the church, which has been said to be one of the church’s main draws, especially for people in college.
“Its substance seems to be built on being trendy and hip, and that’s part of how it has gotten to be so huge in the Seattle area,” he said. “Such a large format has great commercial appeal but nowhere near the same level of accountability or community that the smaller churches can offer, even if they’re not as hip.”
To help congregants find smaller communities within the overall church community, many members join community groups for Bible studies and mutual spiritual growth. Many of the community groups at the UW not only help each other grow in their relationship with Jesus, but also do service work around the U-District. An ongoing project for a few of the groups is renovation of the ROOTS shelter for homeless teens on the Ave.
Despite the concerns that people have about Mars Hill and its doctrine, Meyer remains a true believer of the church and its ability to help the U-District community.
“The 20-somethings are the least-churched people, the least likely people to walk with Jesus, and Seattle used to be the city with [the fewest] Christians in it,” she said. “We all enjoy [Mars Hill’s] awesome bands and cool technology and that we can use that technology to spread the gospel, but it’s about Jesus. Mars Hill is a tool that God’s using to bring people to him.”
*Johnson asked that his real name not be used in this story because he is a teaching assistant at the UW and worried about offending students who might attend Mars Hill.
Reach Copy Chief Parisa Sadrzadeh at lifestyles@dailyuw.com.
14 Comments
#1 Di
on December 9, 2009 at 12:02 p.m.We were just talking about this in English 281 yesterday! Someone in my class stopped going to Mars Hill because of the too-heavy patriarchal structure of Mars Hill's Pastor Mark Driscoll.
The City Church is a much better way to go. We believe in women in ministry. No condemnation. We preach and live grace. 1 Cor 10:15.
#2 Dan
on December 9, 2009 at 1:40 p.m.There are so many things wrong with this article and Mars Hill Church, it's a shame the Daily didn't really do much research on Mars Hill. Where I think you really let them off the hook was on how they treat women. I quote the author, "However, from an insider student perspective, what some perceive as an “anti-woman” stereotype is somewhat flipped." She goes on to talk about a week addressing men. Why not talk about what they've specifically said about women? And how the whole organization is controlled by men? Here's a few great teachings from the Mars Hill pulpit:
-God does not want women to have jobs. Their role is to get married, stay at home and have as many babies as possible. (Conveniently, birth control is immoral, too.) “Women will be saved by going back to that role that God has chosen for them. Ladies, if the hair on the back of your neck stands up it is because you are fighting your role in the scripture.”
-Women also should not seek leadership roles, either in society (“There is no occasion where women led a society and were its heads and the men complied and followed. … It’s a matter of Biblical creation”) or in the church (“Every single book in your Bible is written by a man.”)
And they are just crazy when it comes to Science. Another quote from a Mars Hill sermon:
"Evolution is a lie. Humans were descended from a man named Adam created by God a few thousand years ago. “The lord God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life. This is the making of the first human being, our father Adam. We all descend from him and there was no human life before this man."
And the are super-homophobic:
"Homosexuality is an abomination. People who are gay can change. “Your banners, your floats, your buttons—they’re not good. It’s just like letting cancer come into a body… until the cancer consumes the body and kills you. … We will extricate the cancer, and if that person who has the cancer is repentant and wants to kill the cancer, then we’ll welcome them back. But they have to accept that anything but one man, one woman, one God, one life is sexually immoral."
How exactly can they say they are left of conservatives when they have all the exact same stances on women's roles, abortion, homosexuality, stem cell research, etc? I've worked with Mars Hill folks when they used to run the Paradox on the Ave. The only "hip" element to their church is they have some members that are a little punk/alternative in their fashion sense, but everything they preach is straight up right wing, male dominated, bull. Parisa Sadrzadeh really did no research and basically took the word of the people from this religious cult as the truth. Every other paper that's written about Mars Hill hasn't been scared to expose the truth, why wouldn't Sadrzadeh? Is she somehow involved in the cult and writing from a biased position?
#3 Anonymous
on December 9, 2009 at 2:16 p.m.There was also a week addressing women. http://www.marshillchurch.org/media/t...
I encourage you to listen to what Pastor Mark has said about birth control instead of making suppositions. http://www.marshillchurch.org/media/r...
No one on a Mars Hill pulpit has ever said women should not have jobs.
I'm wondering where you got these "quotes" from...?
#4 Rebecca_F
on December 9, 2009 at 3:05 p.m.I know that Driscoll/MHC is pro-life, i.e. he has preached from the MHC pulpit against abortion, calling it murder. But I don't think there's any MHC teaching against non-abortive contraceptives. I'm not sure on that, though. Although I have listed to some of Driscoll's sermons, I certainly don't know everything he's ever taught. So I can't comment or assess genuiness of uncited quotes. And it would be strange if anyone knew everything Driscoll ever said off the top of their head. It would be helpful if you are going to quote a sermon, if you specified where you are quoting from. Maybe the date of the sermon or a link to the transcript?
#5 anonymous
on December 9, 2009 at 3:17 p.m.I agree, anyone who claims Mars Hill is anti-women has either not taken the time to actually listen to his sermons on the subject- or has stubbornly refused to hear what is being said and the manner in which it is said, or has not paid attention to the extremely loving way he speaks about his wife and his high estimation of her and her capabilities.
Mark has even spoken about his start in the church, during a time when his wife had a job and supported them while he was persuing being a pastor, unpaid. Mark does not espouse the idea that no women should have jobs, but he does uphold the biblical stance that men and women were created equally, but with differing, complimentary roles.
He views women as God's daughters, not to be demeaned or exploited in any way. As a woman, I have am not offended and I don't think that any women who knows her identity should feel threatened by these ideas. I think, as women, we can agree that we are different than men and praise God for all the roles he has given us, whatever they may be (and this does not just include housewife- even at Mars Hill- though it is still a wonderful role as well).
#6 Dan
on December 9, 2009 at 5:10 p.m.Those quotes about women from Driscoll's sermons came from this article in The Stranger from 2006:
http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/Co...
Sorry, they are a creepy cult. I expect their members to defend them like they are, but I also expect The Daily to do background research and not take these people at their word. Read some of the Seattle Weekly and The Stranger articles on them, they were much more in depth and explored both the good side and the bad side of the church.
Mostly I just hope UW students are smart enough to ask questions and not get hooked into this cult. They are sexist, homophobic, against your legal rights to an abortion, anti-premarital sex... pretty much the opposite of most college students. This is a time for students to explore different ideas, religions, experiences and have fun doing so, not sign up with some strict dogma that stands in judgment over perfectly normal things like women's equality, a woman's right to health care or being gay.
#7 christian
on December 9, 2009 at 11:30 p.m.To Dan:
Does Woman's right to health care = abortion?
Most of your comments are aimed at Christianity in general, not so much Mars Hill or Mark Driscoll.
True, Christianity preaches that homosexualiy is wrong (1 Corinthians 6:9-10), probably the same for abortion, though I can't recall any verses on this topic, and as for women in ministry, I don't know (don't really care).
One might defend Christianity in this case but instead I propose the question, how would life even look appealing without some concept of a greater purpose or end-goal? There are so many "pretty-much" unsolvable problems in this world that you just gotta believe that something better (like heaven) exists if you find it.
#8 Dan
on December 10, 2009 at 11:18 a.m."Does Woman's right to health care = abortion?"
The right to an abortion and birth control is part of every women's right to health care, yes! Both are completely legal by the laws of our country and supported by the majority of Americans. You're welcome to choose to not use birth control or ever have an abortion, but that's your choice. Your healthcare choices shouldn't be limited by a religious cult or worse, big government.
"How would life even look appealing without some concept of a greater purpose or end-goal?"
I find it sad (and somewhat pathetic) that you couldn't have a happy, meaningful and fulfilling life without the idea of heaven. We live in a wonderful community in a wonderful country full of all kinds of things that should make your life appealing: love, family, friends, travel, work, hobbies, etc. If your life is so shallow and sad that the idea of heaven is the only thing that keeps even looking appealing (your words, not mine), then I think you need to make some life changes beyond joining the Mars Hill cult.
#9 Anonymous
on December 10, 2009 at 11:25 a.m.Just curious Dan, do you consider all religions to be cults? Or is it just Christianity? Or just Mars Hill Church?
#10 Tammy
on December 10, 2009 at 4:12 p.m.Dan,
The Stranger ranks right above the Onion in terms of journalistic integrity and veracity. The Onion is funnier though.
-T
#11 Sarah
on December 10, 2009 at 7:15 p.m.Cults are small subset or offset religions, the often build insular communities around one leader. Mars Hill seems to fit the bill. They aren't mainstream Christianity.
#12 John Erickson
on December 10, 2009 at 7:21 p.m.@ #10- The Stranger is fantastic, these days they do more in depth research on news stories than any other newspaper in town (this includes the Times). Tammy, do you deny the quotes from your pastor? Care to prove the church is pro-women? How many women are in positions of power in the Mars Hill church?
#13 Jason
on January 6, 2010 at 10:28 p.m.John, Dan,
It's not about Mars Hill in terms of women. Mars Hill simply believes in a fundamental view of the bible which says women should not be in authority over men. (1 Timothy 2)
Here is a section of Mars Hill's website which consists of women preaching and teaching to other women, which is encouraged by the bible. http://www.marshillchurch.org/media/w...
Christians (if they hold true to the bible), believe that God designed men and women and he designed them equal but with separate roles. God has made men to be leaders of family and the pastors of the church. This is simply a difference in roles and has nothing to do with equality, dignity, value, worth, etc. Men and women are equal children of God. Does the president of the united states have any more value, dignity or worth than a house cleaner? No. Same goes with women and men in the church. Different roles, but equal.
I am a Christian man who is married and here is my view. I am the leader of my household, and my wife is my helper. I love my wife more than myself and desire to love her and serve her with everything I have. I desire to forgive her every single time she sins against me and love her without condition. If given the opportunity, I would gladly carry a cross on my lash torn back up a hill to die on it, like Jesus did for me, for my wife.
Jesus loves his church, Jesus died for all of us and we have salvation if we accept his sacrifice and believe in him.
Call it a cult all you want, my desire is that you would know the love that is in Jesus. It's amazing and if you enjoy life now, it's nothing to a life with Jesus and the promise of eternal life to come.
#14 Anna
on February 12, 2010 at 9:38 p.m.Amen! Mars Hill Church is very interesting, although I do not agree with everything Mark Driscoll says it's important to realize that he answers to Jesus, he is a sinner like everyone else and he knows it too. If I did not believe in Jesus I would live my life much differently, for the moment, for cheap pleasures. Where do you go when you die?(And you will die and you don't know when) How you answer this question will, essentially rule how you live you life.
In terms of the place of women at mhc, I agree for the most part and I am a woman, that being said in order for women to accept their role the men must be upstanding because they hold the ultimate responsibility and answer to God. It was only said that they should not be above men in church and in marriage. That being said that does not mean that a women cannot go to work and the man stay home and take care of the children. God has a different plan for every person and every family. That simply means that the husband and wife work together in their family and the church but if there are any disagreements, the man ultimately has the responsibility to make the decision and he is held accountable for it.
Mhc does not believe in abortion because it defines life differently because we believe 'unborn' children still have souls. Many people today are appalled by third trimester abortion, so I ask you what is the difference, a less developed child is still a child nonetheless. When a pregnant woman is murdered the murderer is charged with two lives not just one. So, the life of an unborn baby that is wanted is worth more than that of an unborn baby that is not wanted? This is a double standard. Is it so crazy for a church that loves and believes in God to see abortion as murder?
I believe that every person who calls themself a christian should hold themselves to these standards, otherwise you are not a christian and you ruin the view of christians. If you are not a christian, I do not hold you to these standards, God gave men free will and there should be a separation of church and state. I do hope that people do not get 'hung up' on these issues though because they will always be controversial and they will never be the main focus of christianity. You are a sinner, I am a sinner, I never really understood God before a few months ago but the truth is that there is more than this life, you will die, and at that time you may wish that you would have asked more questions about God and found out what you really believed. I think that it's at least worth checking out, I mean don't you have questions about what happens after death?
you cant save yourself, you cannot contribute to salvation, it is a gift that requires humility, pursue it by the grace of God.
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